27
Aug
08

FWIW: Bugger Off Harry

igh. This is the kind of post I hate. The bitchy, snarky politics of the political blogosphere, the exact thing I try to avoid getting sucked into. But I feel almost as if I have no choice but to say something. Humph. Anyway, if the title doesn’t mean anything to you, you may as well skip the article and wait for me to post about the real world again.

The punchline: Harry’s Place is a cesspool of rightwing nastiness. It’s wrong for it to be closed down, but that doesn’t mean we should join its witchhunt.

First, the back story.

There’s a nasty little blog out there called Harry’s Place, run by a onetime Stalinist turned Western imperialist. I say “little”; actually it’s a pretty big blog, as these things go – thousands more readers than this place, or hundred at least – playing the same role to the pro-war “Left” as the Lenin’s Tomb blog plays to the likes of me. One of their causes celebres recently has been a smear campaign against the movement to boycott Israel, particular within the academics’ union UCU. And recently they struck gold, finding this post on the UCU mailing list from pro-boycott academic Jenna Delich:

John,

In support to your link this may be a long but also an interesting reading:

http://www.davidduke.com/general/humanitarian-disaster_595.html

No comment necessary. The facts are speaking for themselves.

Jenna

JENNA DELICH

Now if you’ve already heard of David Duke, it will be pretty obvious what’s wrong with this. But of course, it’s possible that you haven’t. David Duke is a former leader of the Klu Klux Klan, North America’s foremost White supremacist organisation. If you look at the “about” page on his website, for example, there are plenty of clues to indicate his generally racist and, in particular, anti-Semitic beliefs. But the page to which JD had linked was entitled “Gaza Strip Faces Humanitarian Disaster”, and is followed by an article denouncing the racism inherent in Israeli politics. I’ve scanned through it (it is indeed long), and noticed a few hints in the last paragraph that keen anti-semites would be able to pick up. Most of it, however, is fair enough.

The thing is, you have to be really careful, really strict with anti-Zionism, to avoid being co-opted by the very nasty and insidious traditions of anti-semitism. In particular, it is undeniably true – and highly pertinent – to say that there is a lobby of wealthy Zionists, many of whom are Jewish (but, it’s worth underlining, some of the most aggressive of whom are Christian fundamentalists with more than a touch of anti-semitism about themselves), which exercises enormous influence over the policy towards Israel of the US and UK. It is also undeniably true – and highly pertinent – that there are plenty of racists scumbags out there who would love to tell you that “the” Jews rule the world. We must not give any succour to the latter.

Likewise, it is true that there are many who use wild accusations of antisemitism to dismiss any criticism of Israel, but it is also true that this fog of false accusations provides cover to a lot of genuine anti-semites. That’s something the likes of HP have on their consciences, but we have to be careful not to play into the hands of those who would love nothing more than to deny the existence of real anti-semitism. We also have to be careful not to give ammunition to those who would love to discredit our movement. And JD was careless.

This much is forgivable, really, but the political blogosphere is an unforgiving place. There was a time when this blog was a light-hearted exercise of saying whatever came into my head, to let off steam or to see what it sounded like, as if I was talking to a mate (one who have to be a very good listener, but still). I’ve been disciplined into stressing to fuck over every little sentence, because unlike words spoken at the pub, every little sentence stays written down for all to see long after the mood’s passed in which you’ve said it. And it’s a horrible, horrible feeling to know that someone somewhere could google your name and fall upon dirty and dishonest denunciations from your political rivals, a feeling that once made me seriously consider giving up the blog altogether.

Now, I haven’t seen what HP actually wrote about JD, for reasons that will become clear. But I can imagine it to be very vicious, personal and intimidating. And it’s clear that the correct reaction to discovering her mistake would be an apology. But the record shows that just 5 hours after the post above quoted, she was back saying:

I didn’t realise who David Duke was nor did I hear of him. I just looked at the article not the website where it appeared. Apologies for picking up that website as I personallly am strongly against any racists, anti-semitists and the likes of them. I just found the article quite powerful, and none are saying that Joe Quinn (the author of the article) is a racist or anti-semitist, and the article is quite interesting. So, perhaps we should focus on the article itself and not where it appeared (if we look at it in a broader sense, the website itself appeard on Google and so did the article)? Anyone can put anything on their website… Sincere apologies once again though for picking the wrong website, but it’s the article that I found interesting as it gives some amazing facts and it was not written by David Duke (who, I most certainly agree, has no place in UCU but is the author of the website and not the article).

And then what happened? It seems a certain Mike Cushman of UCU complained, or threatened to complain, to the ISP hosting HP. In his statement, he makes it pretty clear that 1/ he’s long warned against members leaking postings from the mailing list to HP, and 2/ that this is because it usually results in them receiving a fair amount of intimidation, and so 3/ he thinks action should be taken against HP. For the record, I think he’s wrong. Not on point 2/ – it is indeed all about intimidation – but this doesn’t lead to point 3/. Anyone can cry intimidation, as disingenuous as you like, and you don’t want to make it that simple to censor a point of view you don’t like.

If you’re going to take a stand on a controversial issue, like the academic boycott of Israel, you’re going to receive a lot of flak, some elements of which will be more professional, impersonal and intellectual than others. Especially if you allow an opening for reasonable criticism through careless mistakes. Learn to be thicker-skinned in future, and learn to check your sources.

But now, presumably motivated by the implicit or explicit threat of a libel case from JD’s supporters, HP has been taken down. And this is terrible. The more decisions ISPs take over the content of the websites they host, the more precarious is this little bit of democratic space we have carved out for ourselves online. The crux of the matter is, someone should tell JD and her allies that, tempting as it is, closing down HP is not acceptable. It will only make things worse for her (when in a hole, don’t let them taunt you into digging), and it’s just plain wrong. Presumably it’s not to late for her to withdraw her threat, apologise for letting her emotions get the better of her (and again, when you’re the target of that kind of hate campaign, it’s easily done), and that’s exactly what she needs to do.

But I won’t join in the witchhunt against Jenna Delich, who seems to have slipped up, then been drawn into a confrontation from which she hadn’t the nouse to back down. That doesn’t make her an anti-Semitic authoritarian.

PS you should all be aware of two things. Moderation is on. I have a job (shift work at that). It is therefore very unlikely that your comment will appear much before midnight, if at all. Get over it.


21 Responses to “FWIW: Bugger Off Harry”


  1. August 27, 2008 at 11:31 am

    Ah, it’s no great loss. There have probably been numerous legitimate cases against HP which could have resulted in it being closed down…

  2. August 27, 2008 at 11:59 am

    That’s probably true Tom, if you accept libel laws as legit. Personally, I think that every time an ISP shuts down a blog it makes us all a bit less secure.

    In fact, this is a good reminder of how precarious our access to the “New Media” is, all it takes is for someone to pull the plug in the ISP. Sadly, the revolution probably will not be twitterised.

    But yeah, while I can totally identify with the urge to shut HP down – and if it ever shut istelf down I’d be filled with girlish glee – it’s not really on is it? First they came for HP…

    Anyway, I came to spend what should have been my sleepy time writing this because it was all so sickenly one-sided at the time. Since it’s been posted at the misnamed Socialist Unity blog, a lot of commentators have been taking a line a bit more critical of HP’s narrative. Lenin of the Tomb, for example, says:

    I am not standing in “solidarity with Harry’s Place”, no. I believe they can fight their own battles. I am not masochistic enough to suck up to these fools when they get in a bit of trouble. Particularly since they don’t give a damn about free speech (unless it’s their own ‘right to tell people what they don’t want to hear, and then inform on them to their bosses’). No, you can save this particular ’cause celebre’ for someone who has no self-respect. It will not be me.

    If I hadn’t written it already, I probably wouldn’t bother now.

  3. August 27, 2008 at 12:19 pm

    The problem is not with the ISP as I understand it. The ISP is outside the UK but the domain was registered with a UK company. Only HP could be that stupid, I know, but that is what they did. They are looking to switch the name servers to an offshore site, and probably the whole domain as well. This is going to take a day or so, but they will be back.

  4. August 27, 2008 at 1:19 pm

    Bit of light relief: http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/2005/oct/08/mainsection.commentanddebate1 review of HP from the Guardian a couple of years ago. Although, as a disclaimer, I support the right of bloggers to tell commentators to fuck off. It’s a right that I too exercise with gleeful abandon.

    Exile, I agree, largely with your piece. But watch out: it isn’t really unfair to say that JD shouldn’t have been linking to Duke’s website, besides which the original source of the article is pretty dodgy. I know that reckless and dishonest accusations of anti-semitism are always flying around the place, but we have to accept that there are genuinely anti-semitic conspiracy theories about Jews running the world. Those who play the “everyone is an anti-semite except me and Ehud Olmert!” make it easier for the real anti-semites to get in with the principled anti-zionists, but that just means we need to be even more careful not to get mixed up with them. JD should have been told off for her careless linking.

    Where in Manchester are you from?

  5. August 27, 2008 at 3:10 pm

    “But I can imagine it to be very vicious, personal and intimidating.”
    How vicious is it to write “Sheffield-based academic, Jenna Delich – links tofar right websites associated with the Klu Klux Klan”.(This was the statement said was libellous, even though it is completely accurate.

    “But I won’t join in the witchhunt against Jenna Delich”
    This would have been a single isolated HP post, among the dozens they churn out. Except Cushman decided to push the libel action. It was only then that machine started rolling and people came to HP’s defence. Now, Jenna Delich’s name is mud: google her and you get little but this, whereas a couple of days ago, she was unknown outside activist circles. (Although it is worth saying that UCU activist list members have apparently twice called for moderation of racist comments by her.)

    “The thing is, you have to be really careful, really strict with anti-Zionism, to avoid being co-opted by the very nasty and insidious traditions of anti-semitism.”
    Absolutely. Which is why it is worth being careful with statements about “wealthy Zionists”…

  6. August 27, 2008 at 4:07 pm

    I think Lenin is wrong because HP are now playing the victim card and the story is being picked up with a spin of- this is how scummy people who criticise Israel are, they have your website shut down.
    Opposing the take down while also opposing HP’s crap is entirely possible and robs them of playing the victim.

  7. August 27, 2008 at 10:38 pm

    Dave,

    Failsworth, half way between Manchester and Oldham. It’s other claim to fame is that Albert Pierrepoint used to live on Mill Street with his family. His dad, Henry, used to go boozing in the Clogger’s Arms and when I was young there were still old timers who could remember Henry’s tales of the execution chamber. Albert was far more discrete, as was his Uncle Tom.

    Enough of this merry banter. The problem with HP is that they have a lot of form when it comes to attacking people via the back door. They have tried to get people sacked for instance.

    The issue as far as this woman is concerned is to what extent does her link lead to a valid text? The posting of her photo with details of where she works and then the attacks on the site that hosted the text is all pure HP.

  8. August 28, 2008 at 12:01 am

    @Rick:

    Absolutely, and that’s the position I take. But I don’t think there is any particular danger of this sticking, and so I don’t feel any particular need for Lenin to stick his neck out for them. In fact it’s back online already.

    @Bob:

    Picking up on what was quite obviously a mistake (turns out she’s not even a native English speaker FFS how was she expected to be familiar with DD and to pick up on the few, subtle hints at antisemitism within the article) and using it stir up an online hate machine against a political opponent does, I think, qualify as “vicious”.

    Jenna Delich’s name is mud: google her and you get little but this

    And this was precisely the aim of the HPers. The libel action (if it exists) is wrong both on principle and because it handed that smear campaign such an easy victory.

    @Exile:

    No, I have to reaffirm that linking to David Duke is not cool, besides which the original text may seem fairly innocuous – even useful – most of the way through but it still originates from the far right (see the dog whistle phrases, particularly in the last paragraph) and should be avoided. One can understand JD’s mistake but that doesn’t mean that it wasn’t a mistake.

  9. August 28, 2008 at 12:08 am

    @Rick: And now I’ve read the article on the Tomb, I have to say I largely agree with it. HP behaves in the manner of Rewatch, using an obvious distortion as a pretext, and then half the blogosphere lauds them as champions of free speech when someone bites back. For all that JD’s response – if it was hers – was inappropriate, what were they being?

  10. August 28, 2008 at 11:36 am

    I can’t agree with Lenin on this occasion to be honest – saying that we shouldn’t support and stand in solidarity with them, but also that the ISP shouldn’t have shut them down is an essential contradiction. If the same happened to anyone else we’d be up in arms – the fact that HP is an awful blog which supports censorship in its own right doesn’t mean that it should be censored itself – libel laws are dangerous tools. We should be standing in solidarity with any victims of censorship – if we don’t bother for those with whom we disagree, then we’re guilty of tacit support for the censorship. That said, I don’t get much support from the mainstream left on this issue re. no platform, so this isn’t a massive surprise.
    Is there any news on what’s going to happen to HP now?

  11. 11 chjh
    August 28, 2008 at 12:10 pm

    I really, really, really don’t get this First they came for Harry’s Place… stuff. If a trade union managed (temporarily) to shut down the Daily Mail, would Socialist Worker line up in support of the Mail? Rather unlikely. What is the difference?

  12. August 28, 2008 at 12:36 pm

    Chris, this isn’t the same as “no platform”. A democratic institution deciding whom it will and will not promote is something I support, whereas an ISP or DNS – whose only authority comes from their ownership of the means of publication – shouldn’t ideally have any say over the content of the blogs they host. I wrote a post recently about how the idea of “rights” is misleading, and that free speech is more about power relations. http://complexsystemofpipes.wordpress.com/2008/08/25/heart-disease-and-bootleg-clothing/

    That doesn’t mean that your example (to which the answer has to be more nuanced than a straight “no”, imho) works though, chjh (although I admit I’m being a bit facetious with the “first they came for Harry’s Place; if they act like Redwatch they should expect to provoke a reaction). UCU didn’t do this; a UCU member (apparently) made a complaint, based on which the DNS pulled the plug straight away. That’s too much power in the hands of a private company, and apart from anything else that power would end up being used more against the left than the right.

    Anyway, HP is back online, has been for a day or so, with a new DNS. And I hope to see everyone who “stood in defence of freedom of speech” for HP do likewise for Jenna Delich if the demonisation campaign continues. The pressure has already seen her barred from the UCU mailing list, and I am sure there will be calls for her to lose her job.

  13. August 28, 2008 at 1:02 pm

    why don’t you know what HP wrote about jenna delich? not only was the original post up and clear on HP for quite a while before the site was closed down, but also it can be found on a number of other websites, such as my own and also on urban75, and can be found on the back hp sites which are now in operation. it is however fortunate that you haven’t as this allows you to pretend that HPs original post is ‘vicious personal and intimidating’ without any evidence of this at all. The idea that some one presumably qualified to be a member of the university lecturers union can link to a neo nazi web site and recomend it on a union discusion site WITHOUT realising the nature of the site is unbelievable.
    just in case you still can’t find what was originally said you can find it here
    http://redstarcommando.blogspot.com/2008/08/nazi-loving-academics-fuck-off.html
    if the UCU wants to sue me too, then nae bother!

  14. August 28, 2008 at 1:04 pm

    Darren Redstar: apologies for the late moderation and response (he actually posted about a day and a half earlier than what the timestamp says), wordpress marked your comment as spam.

    I hadn’t seen the copies of the original post, just the furore about it. But the title you chose says it all, really, without me needing to click through: you accuse JD of being a “Nazi lover” – when in fact she promptly apologised for having made a mistake – and tell her to “fuck off”. The HP post, now I’ve seen it, calls JD a DD “fan”, then publishes her photo and email address. If that’s not dishonest and intimidating then what is?

  15. August 28, 2008 at 2:17 pm

    An idea- I’m sure Ms. Delich feels like avoiding the whole thing, but if she or someone on her behalf would like to write about what has transpired then we will all publish it. Perhaps Socialist Unity & Lenin’s Tomb could figure out how to get that to happen. In an ideal situation we all have an equal platform and can answer to accusations made against us, but not all blogs are created equal and the take-down story of HP is all over the place, so she is owed similar coverage, this would also make search results over the issue more representative and help remove speculation as to details. This would include a call on HP to also post this writing once they are restored.

  16. August 28, 2008 at 2:54 pm

    Dear Dave,
    I tend to take a somewhat simplistic approach to matters, if someone is happy to employ links from a Nazi website to support their arguments and when caught out, rather than apologise, immediatly do all they can to shut up and censor those who found them out. then I think that they can be called a nazi lover. I was a railway man for 20 years before being laid off and becoming a student, if in any of that time someone had used the RMT or ASLE&F internal mail to promote nazi articles then they would have been kicked out. full stop.
    for ms. deich to claim that she had no idea of the nature of the material she was linking to suggests that she is either dishonest or so exeedingly stupid it calls into question her qualification to be a member of the university lecturers union.

  17. August 28, 2008 at 9:45 pm

    @Darren:

    if someone is happy to employ links from a Nazi website to support their arguments and when caught out, rather than apologise…

    She apologised immediately. See above.

    she is either dishonest or so exeedingly stupid it calls into question her qualification to be a member of the university lecturers union.

    So you’ve never met anyone (the exceedingly stupid aside) who’d never heard of David Duke? You need to get out more. I had never heard of him in my pre-blogging days, I’m fairly sure, and I unlike JD am from an anglophone country.

    If you want to “debate” in this dishonest manner, you’re welcome to do so. Elsewhere.

    @RickB:

    Firstly HP are already restored, have been for over a day now. And I don’t think we should enter into the spirit of the moment by demanding any further statement for her. Besides, even if JD did want to present such a statement, I think you’re expecting a bit too much intellectual honesty from HP if you think they’d publish it.

  18. August 30, 2008 at 1:36 am

    Can I take it from the lack of fresh denunciations that the blogging fraternity has now moved on, back to the real world? If so, then good.

    Now stand by to defend JD’s job.

  19. 19 MrAngryman
    August 30, 2008 at 7:13 am

    Harry’s Place was highlighting a pertinent point, the fact that a person involved in a anti-zionist boycott, chose to link to an anti-semitic article hosted on a former member of the KKK website. This was done to highlight how easily it is to slip from genuine anti-zionism (a disagreement with the policies/politics of the state of Israel) to a position of implied anti-jewishness. The boycott by the UCU is for me a different matter, the choice of an educational union to boycott academics from Israel on the basis of their nationality can be argued to be racist and unfortunately when people criticise the state of Israel there is always the possibility that those comments will be judged to be of an anti religious bent. The HP’s post was designed to highlight this, and justifiably so, there is no excuse for anti-Semitism, especially in circles where they are supposed to be more educated, by linking this article Mrs Delich laid herself open to such claims and by her lack of a forthright apology she further compounded the charges against her. HP’s is entitled to highlight this and we of the blogosphere should applaud the highlighting of racist issues, we may not agree with the politics of HP’s site, we may not even support his sites stance on the state of Israel but we should suport his right to highlight racism/anti-semitism as he sees fit, the same way your site should be supported in the assertions that you draw of the clientèle of Harry’s place site.

    The right/left split should not degenerate into ‘those right wing bigots’, ‘those left wing bigots’ stance, both sides of the divide should see that the act of linking to a far-right site was stupid at best and at worst anti-semitic, either way it was wrong any any attempt to dismiss this is also wrong.

  20. August 30, 2008 at 10:34 am

    unfortunately when people criticise the state of Israel there is always the possibility that those comments will be judged to be of an anti religious bent.

    Is there? Really? By whom? Does this judgement have any claim of making sense?

    The HP’s post was designed to highlight this

    Highlight nothing. It described JD as a “David Duke fan” who “gets her information far right websites” (rather than someone who’s once cited something from a far-right website, by mistake and promptly apologised). It also posted her photo and email address. That’s what we call a dishonest and defamatory smear campaign, and it brings to mind the actions of Redwatch.


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